Please... have mercy on us Orcane mains......#67

Every single time Orcane appears in a patch note I already embrace myself for the nerfs, everyone complains about zetterburn but all he gets is a little tummy tickle. Meanwhile here’s me actively celebrating whenever Orcane doesn’t appear in a patch note cause that doesn’t equate a nerf. Seeing him win EVO alongside La Reina made my gut crawl cause I knew what that was going to entail, a big bag of nerfs to shove into my whale boy’s mouth. Why is Orcane always getting targeted in these patches I thought he was your favourite rival Dan!

the fact that chars like orcane and fleet get nerfed while zetter gets a slap on the wrist and clairen basically stays unchanged just shows how out of touch the balance team is with the actual player base. that guy on the last nolt board complaining about the devs only listening to pro players and influencers was right after all.

In my experience as a casual who often plays orcane, the nerfs that orcane gets generally negatively impact how it feels to play Orcane (as opposed to them actually making him worse power-wise), and that’s frustrating. I feel that something like making him have increased end lag proportional to puddle distance would have a better result without feeling like you died because the game decided that you got juggled for too long.

The nerf is fine, it will just take some time to get used to. Orcane’s recovery was way too strong, I’m glad they are toning it down. Orcane was at least top3, both in strength and annoyance levels. This is making him way more bearable to fight.

You do also realize there was a BIG bubbles buff in that patch? Upthrow is much more consistent.

The nerf is not fine. Not many people enjoy tracking a timer while playing and 12 seconds is laughably short. This was a LAZY attempt to fix a non problem. His up special was already incredbily punishable. If you ran into a campy orcane before, just ban fire capital.

I’m gonna repost metabenn’s video https://medal.tv/games/rivals-2/clips/ng6VDJEI03X70H5Ey?invite=cr-MSxjS1ksMTgxNzI0MTU1

12 seconds isn’t short at all compared to what every other character has. His upB was very rarely punishable, trying to go hit him offstage would just let him TP to puddle, no matter where it was. I know what I’m talking about, I’ve been doing that shit in several matchups.

This made it so that you had to edgeguard one of the hardest character to edgeguard TWICE to be able to kill him. Now he can’t just TP after exhausting all his resources, you’ll just have to learn to mixup and manage your resources, like every other character.

What other character has an up b that becomes non functional on a 12 second timer? Yeah none. Because it’s bad design. But sure go ahead and defend the bad decision so you can have an easier matchup lmao

You do realize you can still orcahop (from DJ, walljump, AND techjump), bubblebutt and sideB? TP isn’t your only option, and if it was, that’s a skill issue sorry.

Also I main Orcane, I’m on the same side of the matchups as you are.

“12 seconds is not in a any form a “LONG” time”
Please rewatch metabenn’s video : https://medal.tv/games/rivals-2/clips/ng6VDJEI03X70H5Ey?invite=cr-MSxjS1ksMTgxNzI0MTU1

“One hit in disadvantage and poof puddle is gone”
No it’s not? If your disadvantage lasted for TWELVE ENTIRE SECONDS you maybe did something wrong, just saying.

“people that only worship their every decision”
Nah I’ve had some concerns about many decisions, I just am able to form opinions on different things after balancing the good and the bad. Here, it’s an obviously welcomed change, as I’ve been saying for months that puddle was broken and needed many nerfs. If I was in the balance team, I’d still tweak a few things, but it’s going in the right way :)

“a lot of people dislike it”
Only people I see that dislike it are orcane mains who never learned to actually recover with him.

“Just because someone disagrees with your terrible take doesn’t make them a crybaby.”
You know very well that this isn’t what I was saying, I’m calling y’all crybabies because you are babies that cry about any change made to our top3 character (he won evo ffs)

“This is a feedback thread. Complaints are perfectly valid here.”
And what do you think I’m doing? :)

Maybe have your own opinion instead of linking a video no one cares about.

Ah and here I thought I was talking to someone that knew anything about Orcane but you just don’t like the matchup.

Spoiler alert you are still going to get washed because the only people that will stick to orcane after this are people that REALLY love him.

How is a new player supposed to pick up the game and know orcanes “special” recovery options? Is there anything IN THE GAME to tell you these things? No.

Most new players are going to assume up special works like smash and be confused and annoyed when they find out that Orcane’s doesnt work after a few seconds. At least on the flipside of that it will just be one less character anyone will care about.

Enjoy your moment of salty validation, highly doubt this iteration of puddle will stay. We can probably look forward to when the dev’s just pick another move from smash ultimate to copy/paste onto orcane and further change the fun little water doggo identity.

“Maybe have your own opinion instead of linking a video no one cares about.”
Metabenn and I have the same opinion, just like all of you have the same opinion that the timer is too short, weird how that works!

“Ah and here I thought I was talking to someone that knew anything about Orcane but you just don’t like the matchup.”
As shown above, I am close to level 1000 with orcane, I mained him since beta and reached diamond. I’m on the same side of the matchup as you are! Ofc you’d know it if you read what I said instead of thinking I’m an evil awful [insert character you don’t like] main!!!!!

“the only people that will stick to orcane after this are people that REALLY love him.”
And I do :) I’ll still go for risky edgeguards, I’ll still 0-death with techchases, I’ll still kill kraggs.

“How is a new player supposed to pick up the game and know orcanes “special” recovery options?”
The official orcane 101 tutorial?

“highly doubt this iteration of puddle will stay.”
It will get tweaked ofc, timer will get shorter because it’s too long, you’ll lose time when hit, shit like this :) It’s still broken.

“We can probably look forward to when the dev’s just pick another move from smash ultimate to copy/paste onto orcane and further change the fun little water doggo identity”
His identity hasn’t changed since launch, his new sideB works very well in his kit as an edgeguard demon, I think it’s one of orcane’s best move in advantage, you just gotta learn to use it.

@Peachota “Orcane was at least top3”
Are we playing the same game? Orcane has never been a top character, those are Loxodont, Zetterburn & Clairen.

LMAOOOOO “NEVER”? Broski he WAS a top tier at least TWICE if not trice 😭
First time netted him the infamous side b and dash speed nerfs because mf could reach you from any point of the map with no effort and the concept of edgeguarding him was literally nonexistent. He was the best character of that period back then, and only Olympia could tie with him.

Now after they gave him more decent recovery options with the new side b, his recovery became simply way too good so they put a timer on puddle.

Twelve seconds is not much usually but in this game?! It’s a ton of time and people can die in shorter time period than that. Besides you can always reset the timer by reapplying that thing and now that takes much less time to do.

wasn’t the new side special a nerf to his horizontal recovery?

Yes, bouncing whale was absolutely a recovery nerf, in comparison to both the old invuln FSpecial and the nerfed one. See the widespread consensus here [https://www.reddit.com/r/RivalsOfAether/comments/1u20de6/orcanes_recovery_is_a_lot_worse_with_the_new_sideb/] and here [https://www.reddit.com/r/RivalsOfAether/comments/1trq6e2/is_bouncing_whale_worse_or_am_i_just_bad/].

However, strangely, aether studios seemed to believe it was a recovery buff, check out this nonsensical patch note from 1.6.2 — this change was used as justification for nerfing his weight (?!?!?)

• Weight: 100 > 95
  • Orcane’s relatively high weight combined with his plethora of recovery mixup options made him extremely difficult to KO without launching him directly into the blastzone. In terms of recovery, his new Forward Special is an upgrade, so we’re toning down a few other things to bring his recovery into a more reasonable place.

One of many things that make me feel like they are pretty out of touch with this char… I don’t get the impression anyone there really plays him seriously anymore. It seems pretty obvious it was a big recovery nerf, even if the switch was a buff overall. I truly have trouble even imagining how they got the impression it was an upgrade because it’s so stiff & linear.

So all in a row we got recovery nerfed from bouncing whale and lowered weight, then pummels destroying puddle (which I think is very good), now this inane timer you have to babysit. The pummel change is good because it’s interactive/counterplay… this is just insult to injury that will incentivize less interactive play to refresh it constantly (see also: various slipstream iterations).

I honestly think they probably “already knew” there would be outcry & frustration from orcane mains and at this point they’re just primed to ignore it — even though the point isn’t that we want the character to be OP, we want the character to stop being less and less and less fun.

I dont really think they care very much to keep orcanes happy anymore because of so much back and forth like this. It’s too easy to apply the strawman of “you’re just upset bc your character got nerfed” to dismiss criticism of the changes. But it’s fine to nerf characters in ways that make sense & preserve character identity, like the pummel change is very good because it promotes deliberate + interactive counterplay. And if that still wasn’t enough you could even consider removing puddle on grab like how Maypul works because that’s still interactive. But instead we get a timer that nerfs your disadvantage and your advantage because you can’t extend offstage as well and promotes campier safe play.

I’m sad to see them still fumbling this character.

I believe none of the devs and none of the beta testers are playing orcane since the release of Olympia.

At first the sideB change was a nerf, but now since we can choose whether or not we want to trigger it, that gives you mixups, good distance, and a hitbox which we didn’t really have before, it really feels much stronger. Especially since you can get nasty reversals and kill confirms with it. The sideB was a HUGE buff.

The weight change was deserved for how fast he is, how insane his recovery is (with and without puddle).

Y’all are just trying to victimize yourselves, he still feels great to use, they just nerfed some stupid parts of his kit (I don’t think we deserve to live to 250 easily). You don’t have to “babysit” it more than other people have to with their gimmicks. Grow up.

And yes I’m still maining him. It promotes more aggressive gameplay where you have to USE your puddle